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anthonygatto
Forum Admin


USA
4280 Posts

Posted - 09/10/2008 :  20:08:05  Show Profile  Visit anthonygatto's Homepage Send anthonygatto a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Poll Question:
Who would you rather see as next President of the United States, Barack Obama or John McCain?

A.G.


Choices:

Barack Obama
John McCain

(Anonymous Vote - Viewing results before voting will spoil your vote)

Adam Solander
Level 2



Sweden
162 Posts

Posted - 09/10/2008 :  20:14:05  Show Profile  Click to see Adam Solander's MSN Messenger address  Reply with Quote
Since I don't live in the USA, I don't know so much about them. But Barack Obama should be nice in that case that he would be the first black president, which I think can be good for the country.

Adam Solander - A Swedish Juggler
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Acrane
Level 2



USA
138 Posts

Posted - 09/10/2008 :  20:20:41  Show Profile Send Acrane a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Obama!!

even though Palin does live very close to russia. haha
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Kasetta
Level 2



Italy
450 Posts

Posted - 09/11/2008 :  03:32:12  Show Profile  Visit Kasetta's Homepage  Send Kasetta an ICQ Message  Click to see Kasetta's MSN Messenger address Send Kasetta a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Barack Obama!


memento gaudere semper

Daniele Caselli
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AndyB
Level 3



United Kingdom
646 Posts

Posted - 09/11/2008 :  04:33:05  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Barack Obama! That Sarah Palin woman's a complete fruitcake.

----------------------------------------

AndyB: "The World's Most Average Juggler"
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anthonygatto
Forum Admin



USA
4280 Posts

Posted - 09/11/2008 :  15:26:50  Show Profile  Visit anthonygatto's Homepage Send anthonygatto a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Since most of you who have commented here so far are from another country, it does go with the polls conducted on television about who the rest of the world would like to see become president. Of course us Americans are so arrogant we more than likely will disregard another viewpoint from a foreign land because - hey... what do they know. Here we are only are only 232 years old yet we think we know it all.

I wish Americans would be more open to suggestion from the rest of the world. It seems as if the only ones who know what's right for this country live outside this country. For me it's a no-brainer, I already made my mind up before I solidified my decision by closely following the campaign. I seriously urge the younger generation that's American and on this forum to consider Obama. We need the youth vote to accomplish this. The McCain campaign is relying on the same "old" voters, the same ones who put Bush back in office. Unfortunately, that generation does not understand our world today, so they stick with the same familiar faces and what do they have to lose... they'll leave this mess for the rest of us to clean up. Don't get me wrong, there are quite a few older adults that do get it, but sad to say there is not enough. If your 18 and older, do the right thing and vote.

A.G.

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Acrane
Level 2



USA
138 Posts

Posted - 09/11/2008 :  18:18:35  Show Profile Send Acrane a Private Message  Reply with Quote
You must be logged in to see this link.

personally, i am going to leave the u.s. permanently if mccain wins.
I just wouldn't want to be known as an american if that happened.
The world hates us enough as it is.
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kamibaka
Level 3



Sweden
560 Posts

Posted - 09/11/2008 :  18:40:46  Show Profile  Visit kamibaka's Homepage Send kamibaka a Private Message  Reply with Quote
If you know how old your country is, then it's not old.
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Dave Altman
Administrator



Georgia
621 Posts

Posted - 09/11/2008 :  19:24:53  Show Profile  Visit Dave Altman's Homepage Send Dave Altman a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Acrane

You must be logged in to see this link.

Wow! What a shockingly candid and dead-on accurate commentary! I didn't know MS-NBC reporters were allowed to be so frank and honest.

Rudy Giuliani is the last person that should be keep bringing up 911. Just ask the NYCFD, who directly blame Giuliani for the death of the firefighters in the Towers. Keith Olbermann even quoted Sen. Joe Bidden's remark about Giuliani's speeches consisting of "...a verb, a noun, and 911."


"Nothing makes a man, or a body of men, as mad as the truth. If there is no truth in it, they laugh it off." ~Will Rogers

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GLF
Level 3



USA
610 Posts

Posted - 09/11/2008 :  23:12:34  Show Profile  Visit GLF's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by anthonygatto

I wish Americans would be more open to suggestion from the rest of the world. It seems as if the only ones who know what's right for this country live outside this country.

A.G.





I see your point, but I for one would rather the USA not follow other countries in how they are increasing government control, etc.
If we don't preserve our liberties no one will.



"If you can't stand behind our soldiers and support them, feel free to stand in front of them."

"When you stop dreaming of Batman, then you will be a real ninja like me." - a 5 year old ninja

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GLF
Level 3



USA
610 Posts

Posted - 09/11/2008 :  23:19:17  Show Profile  Visit GLF's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Solander

Since I don't live in the USA, I don't know so much about them. But Barack Obama should be nice in that case that he would be the first black president, which I think can be good for the country.

Adam Solander - A Swedish Juggler



Why does his color matter? We hear things like this in juggling too (i.e. "we need more black jugglers" or "we need more female jugglers"). I must admit it's kind of irritating.
I look at what the individual has to offer, not at whether or not the ratio of "x vs. y" is balanced.
What does it matter if there are a lot of black jugglers or not? What does it matter if there are a lot of white jugglers or not?
After all, it should be the betterment of the country/art form (relating to juggling and politics) that we are looking out for, not trying to make sure that we've got a "fair" number of minorities in that country/art form.
Just to clarify, I have nothing against minorities, I just get irritated when people say "oh we need more of this group so we can be politically correct".
Also, I hope I don't come across as bashing you/your views. It's just a subject that I come across quite a bit and feel somewhat strongly about, it's certainly not my intention to flame you.



"If you can't stand behind our soldiers and support them, feel free to stand in front of them."

"When you stop dreaming of Batman, then you will be a real ninja like me." - a 5 year old ninja

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Sondre
Level 5



Norway
3549 Posts

Posted - 09/12/2008 :  03:03:54  Show Profile  Visit Sondre's Homepage  Send Sondre an AOL message  Click to see Sondre's MSN Messenger address  Send Sondre a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
Barack Obama, of course.

Edited by - Sondre on 09/12/2008 03:04:10
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plip
Level 1



USA
67 Posts

Posted - 09/12/2008 :  09:12:25  Show Profile  Send plip an AOL message  Reply with Quote
I live in the USA and i will be voting for Barack Obama... But I live in a red state, and it really worries me that McCain/Palin actually have the possibility of being elected. As dumb as it sounds, a lot of these right-wing rednecks don't even care about the candidate or his policies, when it comes to electing someone, they just want someone who they can have a beer with.

Also, when it comes to electing presidents, people in this country often seem to forget about the other 2/3 of our governing process, the Congress, and Senate. Right now the Congress has a Democratic majority, and the Senate is split 50/50 Democrat/Republican. What this means is that by and large, the other branches of government (regardless of their composition) are willfully supporting the rules and policies of the Bush Administration. So, surely who we elect as president will have a big influence, however unless we fix all our representatives, we won't see any substantial changes.

I wish it were just as simple as picking someone good as our head leader, but people need to sort out the pieces as well. The voter turnout in 2007 for US Senate elections was only 29.7% That means that over 70% of the eligable voters didn't even bother.

I think that a big problem with those 70% of Americans that don't vote is that they are too busy being wage slaves, or lack the time, education, or information to substantially make a difference. This leaves the people with lots of free time and money (sorry to say usually the old people that vote on values rather than facts) to vote for policies that (seem to) benefit themselves instead of the general population.
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Dave Altman
Administrator



Georgia
621 Posts

Posted - 09/12/2008 :  09:27:32  Show Profile  Visit Dave Altman's Homepage Send Dave Altman a Private Message  Reply with Quote
You bring up a lot of good points, Charles. They are just the tip of the iceberg, I'm afraid. Who becomes president is important and can make a difference, but it is a lot more complex than that. The US government was designed as a compromise and it was a product of it's time. In some ways, the founding fathers were brilliant and in other ways, the compromise was messy. They even knew it at the time. Unfortunately, the messy parts haven't been cleaned up, but made even messier.

The supreme court has much more power than the average person thinks. They are in there for life and they determine how laws are interpreted, which can change the law from what the congress intended.

The indirect democracy (use of delegates) was designed for two main reasons, one was more practical and valid, the other less noble. The practical reason for have delegates was the lack of quick transportation and communication. There wasn't a way to inform the populous and have them directly vote in an informed way on the issues. The other, less noble reason, the founding fathers felt the average American was too ignorant to make any intelligent decisions. Even this view had more validity at the time. Of course, there are too many ignorant people today, but in the 18th century, there were a lot more people that didn't have any schooling or any kind of formal education.

We don't need an indirect democracy any longer. The delegate system should be abolished! The party system should be abolished as well. There shouldn't be a primary election, either. Why should a little northern state decide who the rest of the country picks as president? When I think of all the wrong things that have developed over the years with the political system, I feel like running through the streets like a wild man, screaming, "Why!!? Why!!!? Why!!!!?"

I remember being taught about city-states in Greece, where each man voted. (yeah, they were sexist back then, but...) Each man went to one place and were told the issues of the day, then each one voted on what to do and who to elect to deal with the day-to-day problems of the city-state. I thought then and now, that is the way it should be. I think the women should have the right to vote, too, but other than that, the city-state model is about as perfect as a governmental system can be. The city-state was taught to us, but they didn't want us to like it. They called it "Radical democracy*" implying that the American system was somehow superior by being an indirect democracy.

Let's abolish countries! Let's just have city-states where people actually know their leaders in a face-to-face way, and truly have "one person, one vote" on practically everything. Who knows, maybe if we have this type of system throughout the world, we'll develop modern cultures that would rival ancient Greek cultures!
__________________________________
*An article on Radical Democracy:

You must be logged in to see this link.


"Nothing makes a man, or a body of men, as mad as the truth. If there is no truth in it, they laugh it off." ~Will Rogers

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Dave Altman
Administrator



Georgia
621 Posts

Posted - 09/12/2008 :  10:27:13  Show Profile  Visit Dave Altman's Homepage Send Dave Altman a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by plip
So, surely who we elect as president will have a big influence, however unless we fix all our representatives, we won't see any substantial changes.

What a brillant idea! We shouldn't allow them to breed!


"Nothing makes a man, or a body of men, as mad as the truth. If there is no truth in it, they laugh it off." ~Will Rogers

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anthonygatto
Forum Admin



USA
4280 Posts

Posted - 09/12/2008 :  14:11:58  Show Profile  Visit anthonygatto's Homepage Send anthonygatto a Private Message  Reply with Quote

quote:


I see your point, but I for one would rather the USA not follow other countries in how they are increasing government control, etc.
If we don't preserve our liberties no one will.



"If you can't stand behind our soldiers and support them, feel free to stand in front of them."

"When you stop dreaming of Batman, then you will be a real ninja like me." - a 5 year old ninja





Are you saying the government is protecting our liberties? Have you heard of the Bush Doctrine? Look it up. Also, what liberties are they allowing us concerning our health? Oh, that's right, like Bush says, "if we need health care we can go to the emergency room." I guess he forgot that you have to pay for it. Nearly 50% percent of all bankruptcies in America are a result of medical bills; this could be eliminated if we had a real health care system.

We all live under the assumption that we are free, but that is far from the truth in my opinion. Just the other day I was having an evening picnic with about 6 friends after the show in a park; it was a beautiful evening and we sat by candle light and ate some delicious sushi with a nice red wine. We stayed about an hour before we were told by the police the park closes at 11:00(even though I saw no doors). I remember doing the same thing in Germany yet never being questioned by the police. This doesn't seem to free to me, maybe I'm just a complainer though or a "whiner" as the Republicans would say.

You say we're free, I say look at the last two elections, then evaluate how free we really are.


A.G.

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